Houston Democrats

You don't support the war but support the troops? (deleted by moderator). This is all politics, this is you don't like the fact that republicans control the House, the Senate, the Whitehouse, and soon the supreme court. This has to be the ultimate low, and the fact that this has not seen light on a single damn network news cast yet is the ultimate proof of media bias. This is what recovering troops and their family have to hear about? It makes me sick to think that these are the tactics being used by the radical left which is screaming louder and louder in the face of American success.

How do you define American Success? The number of people being killed, wounded? Pat Robertson apparently doesn't believe we have been successful, Chavez is still alive. Great posting, well reasoned arguments, use of simple words. We are fortuate we have the radical left for much more intelligent postings.

Ok, from support our troops to Pat Robertson from success to killing Chavez, nice way to tie everything together. I guess you had no real arguments or disagreements from what I said before. Nice heat of the moment could find anything better to say posting. Like you said and I quote:
"We are fortuate we have the radical left for much more intelligent postings."

You said it "fortuate", because fourtunate we are not.
Have a nice day.

As Lyn was saying, f you can help with housing for some of the folks on the tour or want to host the event, go to http://www.bringthemhomenowtour.org/userdata_display.php?modin=50&uid=4

I'm too pooped to HTML properly. Sorry, you'll have to copy and paste into your browser.

Joe, whoever you may be besides a GDR--if one can be that and something else--you're damn straight that I, for one, don't like the Repug control of nearly all the branches of government. And I also don't like the way you got there (See Election Fraud and Cheating and Lying). I'd like you to point out some specific instances of Repug success--let alone "American"-- besides the aforementioned fraudulent voting. If you count Iraq as one of your successes, you're just not paying attention, sweetheart. You need to stop emulating your humanity-impaired president(who's given to excruciating gaffes like telling Gold Star Mothers that he deserves to be able to get on with his life) and do something desperate like read the newspaper (Reuters or The Manchester Guardian) or watch CNN instead of Fox or go to that nameless base on the east coast and watch the unloading of coffins from Iraq. The only Repug successes are the ones in which the opposition is beaten down (see DeLay/Hastert, House of Representatives)or piles of money are raked in by two-bit criminal lobbyists selected by Tom DeLay, who drops 'em when they get caught, or the Secret Service manages to fill auditoriums with the GDR faithful so our endlessly-vacationing president won't have to answer questions like the one Cindy Sheehan wants to ask him. (I myself would just like to ask him to define "noble.")
The latest American success, and one I'm delighted to acknowledge, is Camp Casey in Crawford. Its existence says that Americans--and, I'm sorry to disappoint you, not just the Lefties--are finally waking up to the catastrophe that is the current un-American administration. Bush and his puppet masters brought failure with them into the halls of American government. God willing, maybe now we'll rise up out of that ditch on the road to Prairie Chapel and throw the bastards out.

Muriel,

God bless at least somebody coherent (somewhat) decides to make a statement. The GDR thing I really don't know I try to keep God aside from my personal views (if I understood correctly what GDR meant). My point in regards to this whole mess is this. I am a military man, from a very proud military family. Since the civil war (on both sides at one point)there have been members of my family that have call themselves proud and galant soldiers. My grandfathers both members of the great generation served in WW2. My father and several uncles (some dying) served in Vietnam (I think some of the people you associate with refered to them as baby killers when they came back). I know a bit about Pvt. Casey died and he knew when he enlisted and then re-enlisted one of the side effects of being a soldier and that is called dying. Some people hear via the news outlets(I guess your favorite CNN) that the man was a Humvee mechanic and some think that he died in a fringe moment of this god awful shitty mess (sorry for the language) called war, he actually died while volunteering himself in a quick response unit in the Fallujah battle, meaning that he went in as a soldier not as a mechanic in one of the high points of the battle to help others. In short he knew as a soldier that he could die as others did before he. As a soldier I truly respect his valor and commitment and I believe that the memory that your cause is mentioning and tarnishing is the one of a true hero. Would you give your life for something you believe? He truly did. But is he being remembered for that? No, Casey Sheehan is being remembered as the poster child of a group of people that forgot about him completely and their agenda is to "get even" with a single man George W. Bush because in their point of view he stole power away from them.
I frankly do not care if Mrs. Sheehan goes to Mr. Bush's door, slap him across the face and tells him he is the devil himself. What gets under my skin is that the memory and heroism of Pvt. Sheehan has been forever tarnished by the circus that you and others like you have manage to create. I am sorry to disagree with you but Camp Casey is not an example of American success, if you or others that share your point of view would have done Camp "what ever you wnat to call it" and made a difference on your own not using my fallen brother's name to further your cause, then and only then I would agree with you. Every cross that has been planted on that field in Texas for the amusement of an ideal is the biggest slap in the face to the memory of those fallen. I, as many others that know that our choice of serving my country can lead to a painful end, will have to carry on with our very own choice. By the way I don't need to go anywhere and see coffins I have seen what fills those coffins and they are not just the names that you and people like you throw in the air like spit in the wind to further your little personnal vendetta against a man, what fill those coffins our patriots, heros, brothers, my brothers in arms, some of them I had to carry in order to make sure they can get home in one of those coffins. Because one thing I have learned over the years "No one is left behind", to bad that would not be the case for Pvt. Sheehan and others will be as soon as you or the people that you are against get what they want. Hopefully when I go back once again to do my job, I would not have to come back in a coffin, not because I don't want to die, but because it would be less of a chance of my name to be mentioned by you.

Best Regards,

Joe

Joe,
I have been reading your comments and feel I need to say a thing or two.

The first thing is yes, Casey Sheehan did re-enlist -- under the stop loss program. Do you have any idea what that means? It means that Casey wasn't given much of a choice whether or not to reenlist. He had to stay. If you are in the military you know this. Please, my friend, do your homework and learn the true story. Casey has not been forgotten. Cindy is Casey's voice now because he cannot speak for himself, just as I am Jeremy's voice.

Secondly, as a Gold Star Mom (my son Jeremy died on Feb. 13, 2004) it is an honor for me to stand up and say that I do not support this war. My son, if he were alive today, would not be supportive of this war. This is a war that has been based on lies from the very beginning, lies that are coming out into the light of day every day. I talked to a young man today who was in Baghdad at the very beginning of the war. He said the Iraqi people were glad that we were there, but took a wait and see type attitude. He went back to Baghdad earlier this year and talked to many of the same people. The Iraqi people do not feel that we have done any good for them. These people told my friend that at least under Saddam they had electricity to cool their homes when it is 110 degrees outside, clean and safe water to drink, cook and bathe in, and they felt safe to let their children go outside.

Iraq is headed into a civil war and it will be America's fault. We took away their leader -- they should have done this themselves or asked for help -- and we have completely toppled their infrastructure.

One of the things I am very happy to see is that there is now open and honest discussions about the war from both sides. Up until this time it was very one sided, and that was pro war.

I did not walk the memorial in meditation today for entertainment or for amusement. In fact, I'd rather be just about any place else in the world, doing anything else (a day at the beach with a margarita would be really nice). I feel the loss of every single soldier, the pain of every single parent, brother, sister, aunt, uncle, son, daughter and grandparent when another soldier dies. Believe me, I am not doing this for fun and I am not being paid to do it. My job is in peril every day because I speak out against this war. When I go into public venues I have to have a security person keep an eye on me because of the pro war supporters who have a tendency to become overzealous. They do not understand peace, they do not understand the pain of burying your son. Because of the lovely Patriot Act, I have to worry about my phones being tapped and my email messages read by eyes they were not intended for, even though I am not a terrorist and I am no threat to anyone -- unless speaking my truths is a threat, which it is, apparently, to some people.

One last point and then I'm done. I want to make it very crystal clear to you that I support each and every soldier who is serving his/her country. They are honorable men and women doing the best job they can do every single day. They deserve our support. But support should be more than slapping a magnetic yellow ribbon on the back of a car and forgetting about it. When Jeremy went on active duty, I hung a yellow ribbon in my tree. That ribbon stayed in that tree until his unit came home from Iraq a year after Jeremy's death. It stayed in that tree until after his best friend and his Commanding Officer came to see me. I wrote to them the whole time they were in Iraq and I worried about them as though they were my own sons.

Amy Branham
Gold Star Mom

Joe: If I had known you were a military man, I would've given more thought to what I said, not because I don't sincerely believe that my point of view is as valid as anyone else's, but because I realize that the Camp Casey issue is open to a lot of misunderstanding. I would not denigrate a soldier's commitment to his/her principles, but I don't believe in the old saw, "My country, right or wrong."I want my country to be right. I don't have a vendetta against George Bush because he's a Republican. I despise him because he lied to the American people about the reasons he shoved us into war in Iraq and thereby caused the deaths of hundreds of good men and women. If you don't believe he lied, you need to read "A Project for the New American Century." It's on the web, and it will tell you that he knew before he became president and before 9/11 that we would invade Iraq. He is the NeoCons' puppet. They planned that preemptive strike against Iraq years ago, and he and Karl Rove & Co. carried it out while wrapping it in the American flag and in the American commitment to freedom. Iraq had absolutely not one thing to do with the attack on us on 9/11. If Bush had wanted to punish the country that gave us that particular band of terrorists, he would have invaded Saudi Arabia, since that's where 19 of them came from. Instead, he sent American men and women to die in Iraq for oil and for bases that we're building so we can exploit the resources of that godforsaken country, all the while telling those good soldiers that they're protecting America and making it safer. I venerate soldiers like Casey Sheehan for the same reason I venerated soldiers who died in Vietnam: because they gave their lives believing they were defending their country when they were really being exploited and betrayed by a bunch of cynical, despicable politicians of both parties who stood to gain by that war. I never called a Vietnam soldier a baby killer because I never thought of them that way. I saw them as victims, just as I see American soldiers now in Iraq as victims of a cynical, despicable administration that has to lie to them and to the American people daily because their whole program is based on lies. If they once told the truth, or allowed someone in the government to tell the truth, the whole edifice would crumble and they'd be exposed as the traitors and charlatans they are. I see Camp Casey and the white crosses of Arlington West as a tribute to brave men and women who gave their lives for America or for each other in the mistaken belief that they were defending their country, because that's what their commander-in-chief, lying in his teeth, told them.

If I'm wrong, I'll take the responsibility for being wrong. But I'm not wrong, and I'm certainly not wrong about George Bush, who, if there is a hell, will burn there for what he's done.

The notion that you can't be against an unjustifiable, costly, demoralizing, ill-fated war for profit and still be proud and supportive of the men and women who's duty it is to fight it is simply ludicrous. Like saying you can't believe in God and evolution at the same time, just a truism that some people on the right like to shout to make weak-minded folks feel guilty. Many of us on the left are quite proud of our military and want it to survive. Neoconservatives figure that when they've used this one up and thrown it away they can buy themselves another one. And who knows, with their stolen oil money, maybe they can, but then it would be THEIR military, not ours. Meanwhile, we'd like ours back, please.

This would be my last entry into this message board. Thank you for taking the time to make my own beliefs stronger.

It is amazing how people just become experts after the fact and how they just use certain things here and there to make their points.
Mrs. Branham with all due respect to you, sorry but as a responsible adult I try to keep myself informed on thing that can affect me and my family. I know what Stop Loss is for the obvious reasons, also because is not the first time it has been applied I first knew about it in 1991 during Desert Shield/Desert Storm. Plus I can be wrong but according to the information I have Pvt Sheehan enlisted in 2000 then re-enlisted August 2003 prior to November 13, 2003 when stop loss was enacted. So who did not do his/ her homework here? How come nobody knew about things like this until they hit you in the face. These are the little things that people don't care to find out or to ask about. Wake up call, once you join you become an asset of the government. The can not only find ways to extend your commitment, but find ways to get rid of you faster that you can imagine, if it benefits the government
The point is you become a part of the Armed Forces regardless of Branch, you will be used as such, sorry for the honesty. I am very sorry you lost your son, but he chose to be in one way or the other an asset of a machine put together with the purpose that at one point or another will wage or will participate in an armed conflict or war and in war people are meant to kill each other. I am sorry to bring this out to you, but the purpose of joining the Armed Forces (hint the name) is not to just to get a cool job, travel the world and get money for college, sorry it just doesn't work that way. As a member of the Armed Forces you can be called to an armed conflict and there is the possibility that you would die. This was not a newly introduced concept or foreign to the knowledge of Pvt Sheehan, your son Jeremy, yourself and many others that are banging the unfair drum against this war. You are acting like this was not ever mentioned or given as a choice. Sorry but ignorance or becoming blind with anger is not an excuse. Dying in war regarless of what propmted it is a choice that all of us in the Armed Forces and you on your whether you like it or not military family member status have to live with.

The point that you just basically dismissed to give me your I am sorry to say very one sided bleeding heart account, was my very sincere vote of respect of Pvt. Sheehan as a soldier. Maybe you have read this before:
Casey Sheehan had re-enlisted in the U.S. Army voluntarily when he was 24-years-old, after serving his first hitch successfully. Casey Sheehan was in fact a hero who received a Bronze Star. He was attached as a mechanic to the artillery division of the 1st U.S. Cavalry in Iraq. When a convoy of soldiers from Casey’s unit was attacked in Sadr City by insurgents, Casey volunteered (read this carefuly) to join a rapid rescue force to get them out. His commanding sergeant told him he did not have to go into combat, because he was a mechanic and not an infantryman. Casey was quoted telling his officer, "I go where my chief goes." He was tragically killed during the rescue attempt. The source for this story? Cindy Sheehan herself on May 2005.

My point again, he chose his destiny.

Like I said before I don't care about Mrs. Sheehan's motives and actions. I dismissed her as a very silly little person some time ago since her rantings on Israel and Palestine, how we are in some way terrorists ourselves and some other comments she has made over time.
I am glad I don't have to deal or listen to somebody like that, that's your thing, hope it gives you peace.

All of you on your little rallies and such want to know what was so noble about this war and why soldiers are dying for a cause, as soon as you get your answer let the world know then keep going with your life. I have met other Gold Ster Moms (probably the most cruel tittle ever for a human being) and I can tell you there is nothing in the world, no answer, no explanation on why a parent should bury its offspring regardless on how it happened, in war, slipping in the tub whatever the cause, burying your own children is against nature, I really believe that, I will never contend that, but I can tell you that as you made your choices in life, we as members of the Armed Forces made our own. As soldiers is "not to ask why but to do or die" a very famous old quote, because we made that choice. I guess some will contend that we have been brainwased or tricked to think this way, not at all, our way to think this way is something that is in our human nature, some have other ways set of beliefs, nobody thinks the same way at the same time or is oblige to do so, that is Freedom and it is being exercized every time we make a choice, for the best or for the worst.

And for you Muriel (sorry for being so casual) not to worry, you made your point in the best way that you saw fit I admire honesty more than politics. Good luck to you

My best regards to all of you, and support your troops.

Joe

Remember the old worn out saying, or excuse:

Freedom isn't free.

It has cost us $300 Billion, the lives of 1865+ soldiers, over 13,000 maimed soldiers, tens of thousands women and children killed, and the respect of the world.

You're right! Freedom isnt free. It has cost us dearly, and it isnt even for OUR freedom!

Joe,
Of course you are right, the Armed Forces is created to kill people -- in the protection of our country! It is the responsibility of our leaders to make sure that is what the armed forces is used for. However, that is not what they have done in this case and we are holding them accountable for their actions. Yes, our sons chose to serve their country in the military and we are very proud of them.

I know Casey re-enlisted -- under the stop loss program which is nothing more than a back door draft designed to keep men and women in the military to fight this dispicable war that has caused much more harm than good. In fact, I am very good friends with Cindy and I know her stand on this, what happened to Casey and his decision to go with his chief. He was honorable enough to take the chance that he would die because he wanted to protect his brothers.

What most people don't want to know is that Casey was lied to when he entered the military. He was promised he would be a Chaplain and never see combat. But so many forget that little aspect of the story. I guess it's convenient for those pro war supporters who want to bash Cindy and the rest of us to forget that our boys were lied to when they entered the military.

That's okay, though. Just more lies on top of lies that our administration and you don't seem to care squat about as long as you can wave your flags and call yourselves patriotic.

The rest of us are going to make damn sure those so-called leaders of our country who hide behind the flag are brought out into the open. If they don't take responsibility for their actiosn they can and will be replaced. We are their employers, for God's sake. They are nothing more than public servants and it's about time they learned that little lesson.

Amy

Mrs. Branham,

I know I said that I was not going to post further but I hate non-sense and lack of wit, plus I hate when people try to insult my patriotism.
I read your reply and congratulations, you hit a nerve this time is personal not patriotic as I tried before .

This one really pissed me off
You said: "Just more lies on top of lies that our administration and you don't seem to care squat about as long as you can wave your flags and call yourselves patriotic."

Regardless if it was a lie, I am a patriot and I wave my flag proudly because I deserve and did earn my right to do so. And it was not for being a half witted twit like you and your good friend Mrs. Sheehan. I can tell that you are good friends judging by your lack of understanding on other peoples point of view. And to tell you the truth I do not consider her version of anything as a smart choice of the right thing to say or think and to assimilate or adopt her rethroric is not a sign of being a "smart thinkng leftist"
In my posting I did not even try to insult your points of view and grief at any point or lied to you at any point I was just honest, maybe too honest for your very simple mind. So if I seem insulting now, good that was the point.

Next You need to learn how to read and understand what you read not just go between the lines and come up with a halfway there answer.
You said: "I know Casey re-enlisted -- under the stop loss program"
From my original statement: He re-enlisted August 2003 prior to November 13, 2003 when stop loss was enacted. So again it was his choice.

"Like I said before I don't care about Mrs. Sheehan's motives and actions. I dismissed her as a very silly little person some time ago since her rantings on Israel and Palestine, how we are in some way terrorists ourselves and some other comments she has made over time."
I guess you had nothing to say about this.

And last Casey and your son were not lied upon joining the military, you and your good friend lied to yourselves thinking that dying could not happen to them. The only reason of why you and Mrs. Sheehan are so vocal "now" is the fact that both you lost your sons and then just flipped. None of this would had even happened if they were alive right now and you know it. And actually what I think really made Mrs. Sheehan tick the most was that she never really like the idea of her son joining the military then re-enlisted against her own wishes. I think her motives go a lot deeper and are a bit darker than either you or me are lead to think.

How bad can lying to yourself can be is another part of the history that Mrs. Sheehan was once again the source:
"I also visited an army recruiting office on my way home and asked about Casey being promised a job as a chaplain’s assistant only to be thrust into harm’s way. The recruiter explained to me that on re-enlistment, the Army’s B.E.A.R. program (Bonus Extension and Retaining) guarantees everything in writing. If Casey was a mechanic during his first hitch, that was the only thing he would have been guaranteed per his re-enlistment contract.
Further research showed that a chaplain’s assistant is a combat infantry position (meaning in the line of fire), whereas Casey was deployed in a non-combat job as a mechanic."

In short a chaplain or a chaplain assistant is not in the rear with the gear as a mechanic can be if he choses to push it.

Casey Sheehan sought combat duty for his country and should be honored for it.

Frankly if anybody wants to be against this or any other war, please do, it is your right to do so, neither me or nobody else has the right to tell you otherwise, but please don't blind yourselves with poisoning rethoric and nonsense like the one Mrs Branham and her seemingly "good" friend Mrs. Sheehan bring to the table.
And like I told Muriel Stubbs at an earlier entry:
"if you or others that share your point of view would have done Camp "what ever you want to call it" and made a difference on your own not using my fallen brother's name to further your cause, then and only then I would agree with you."
At least Muriel is a somewhat anonymous individual that for what I can read is protesting against this war by honest principle plus she can read and understand prior to rebuting.

Done wasting my time.

I hate to see all of this squabbling over patriotism, and who's more patriotic. Patriotism is an emotional hot button and a red herring. To the extent that the Bush Administration has exploited people's patriotic feelings to drum up support for an otherwise unjustifiable war, they need to be, and will be, called to account. Otherwise, we ought to be for war or against war and stop trying to claim that one position or the other is unpatriotic, because that just confuses the issue.

"Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel"....Samuel Johnson. In 2003 it became the FIRST refuge of same.

I agree with Mike Chappell to the extent that, where war is concerned, people of principle and conviction must take a stand. Contrary to what Joe thinks, I'm about as anonymous as a red cape in a bull ring, so here's my stand: I'm opposed to this Bush/Rove/NeoCon war (which, I feel obliged to say, seems to me to be mainly supported by "summer soldiers and sunshine patriots," and a lot of people who've never been to war and don't intend to go themselves or to send their children, though they don't mind sending or cheering on other people's children, who, when they are killed, can be accused of knowing what they were getting into when they signed up--which is, of course, not true. Some of them might perhaps be guilty of believing what Wilfred Owen, who died at 25 in WWI, called "The old Lie": "Dulce et decorum est/Pro patria mori,"["It is sweet and fitting to die for one's country"] because it was told to them by their commander-in-chief, who never risked even a whisker in a war but is a first-rate liar.) I believe in old fashioned American Democracy, the kind that Benjamin Franklin was talking about when he told a woman who had asked about it that he and his associates had designed a Republic--"if," he said to her,"you can keep it." I believe we are in the political clutches of a band of charlatans who not only can't keep it but don't want to. They don't give a damn about our Republic or about Democracy. They believe in war as a political/economic power tool and in our military men and women as fuel to keep it running.
I, on the other hand, see our soldiers as among the most precious commodities we produce: our children, whom we ought to nurture and to cherish, not send them out to risk their lives in a criminal enterprise so a criminally corrupt administration can prosper.

If that's unpatriotic, tough. I believe that, on a cold night when one of your children or someone else you love has died in an unjust war based on lies and conducted by gutter patriots, and you are inconsolable, you could wrap yourself in the flag and freeze to death.